Solving the 12VHPWR Connector Problem

[u/DallasGrave]

It is a supplementary conversion. The 12VHPWR connector is still used but the individual conductor current and temperature is dramatically reduced. I've got a whole lot of test data coming soon.

Edit to add: There is a pickup PCB soldered to the contacts for the original 12VHPWR header and that feeds the auxiliary dual 8 pin board. The power draw and temperature across all conductors is substantially lower, about ~3A. The card was running full load for 48 hours at 550W and the wires never crossed 40c even at the joint. It is three cables total.

[u/Zorcky-2C]

I came up with a better idea to solve the problem:

[u/Ottoman87 → u/Zorcky-2C]

Jensen Disappointed

[u/Ok-Pomelo-1298 → u/Zorcky-2C]

This. But if they’re so set on their precious 12V-2x6, they could simply implement balancing on the gpu pcb, just like they did with the 3090 Ti. As I understand it, the device in the post is a balancer - just an external one.

[u/DallasGrave → u/Zorcky-2C]

If only. When there is a 5090 with a triple 8 pin, maybe we'll all switch. (Which is happening. Working on it now.) This is meant as a universal option.

[u/RECAR77 → u/DallasGrave]

Don't you need 4 for 600W?

[u/DallasGrave → u/RECAR77]

No. That'd be 5.6A per conductor, which is already 30% less than what the 12VHPWR pulls.

[u/brantrix → u/DallasGrave]

The 12vhpr connector pulls the wrath of Hades himself

[u/RECAR77 → u/DallasGrave]

But I thought 12vhpwr is "rated" for 600W and 8 pin is rated for 150W? 

Or are you saying that putting 600w through 3x8p is both possible and realistically safer than 600w through 12vhpwr?

[u/DallasGrave → u/RECAR77]

Yes and yes. The 8 pin connector requirement by Intel is actually 7A per pin. Per header though is 150W, which is only 4.5A. An 8 pin header should be capable of 252w at OE spec and they can be ordered all the way up to 13A contact range. The 8 pin is using only 64% of it's "limit" vs the 12VHPWR is at 91% at 600W.

[u/-Aeryn- → u/DallasGrave]

That's a key part of why it has the safety record that it does, you can't just add an extra 33.3% amps to each pin (3x 8pin for 600w) and expect it to work as reliably.

That ~doubles the connector/wire heating.

[u/No_Accountant3232 → u/-Aeryn-]

And you definitely can't decrease wire and pin size and pull more power through it

[u/DallasGrave → u/-Aeryn-]

600W would still put it at only 79%.

[u/Warlider → u/DallasGrave]

...sure but you see how pushing the safety bracket caused the 12vhpwr to be shit to begin with. Arent you simply moving the fault point onto close-to overloading the pcie instead of the hipower? You are gaining 10% of a safety margin.

[u/DallasGrave → u/Warlider]

Total load is not the issue. Yes, it's 12% more total. But its a 33% drop in load per wire at the same gauge.

[u/DallasGrave → u/[deleted]]

He asked a direct question. His question was would triple 8 pin be capable of carrying 600W and realistically safer than 12VHPWR? The answer is yes. It will have less total resistance and will be cooler.

[u/Cute-Pomegranate-966 → u/DallasGrave]

This is irrelevant. It would need 4 not 3 or it wouldn't meet spec. Period.

[u/DallasGrave → u/Cute-Pomegranate-966]

It's an either/or. Not a yes/no. 3x8 can handle more amperage than the 12VHPWR header.

[u/Cute-Pomegranate-966 → u/DallasGrave]

Yes, we know that. But what i'm saying is your suggestion is purely academic. They would not put out a 600w power connection configuration with less than 4 plugs. Plain and simple.

This makes it irrelevant to the reality of replacing the single plug.

[u/ime1em → u/DallasGrave]

Be like that guy who made his own lol

[u/ghaginn → u/Zorcky-2C]

that's a lot more pins than needed. if only there were existing connector designs suited for high current..

[u/alwaystired1982 → u/Zorcky-2C]

Yup perfect case of "if it ain't broke dont fix it"

The 295x2 drew 500 watts from two 6+2 pins and had zero melting cables.

[u/Warlider → u/alwaystired1982]

https://www.overclock.net/threads/amd-r9-295x2-power-requirements-warning.1480569/

https://linustechtips.com/topic/1309174-rx295x2-8-pin-power-melted

AMD just ignored the safety limit in this case same as nvidia with highpower. 295x2 was just a niche af product so you havent seen many melted ones. Saftey margins are there for a reason. I dont need a 12vHPWR 8 pin edition.

[u/alwaystired1982 → u/Warlider]

A 6+2 pin is rated for double its capacity so with the pigtail its rated for 600 watts because they are rated for double what they supply this is why the 295x2 disregarded the pcie spec,

A 12vhp cable is supposedly rated for 700 watts which is a tiny overhead......

The 12vhp connector is melting on 9070xt cards using it thats a 350 watt card.

[u/Warlider → u/alwaystired1982]

What? 8+2 in the intel basic specification is rated for 150 watts. There is a hefty saftey buffer of some max 280ish watts per connector. That doesent mean every single random 8 plug will be capable of or rated for above 150 watts.

600 watts for random 8 pins means you are pushing both 8 pin plugs ABOVE the current nvidia "another 12v hpwr has burned down" pitiful 10% saftey margin point.

Corsair has a separate standard that basically takes the 8 pin and actually pushes 300 watts over it, but that doesent mean every single cable will safely pull 300 watts over it.

[u/Sogger_Sogson → u/Zorcky-2C]

Hell yeah.

[u/Cute-Pomegranate-966 → u/Zorcky-2C]

You'd need 4 for a 5090. But sure.

[u/shhbb]

I solved it by being too poor for Nvidia and settling for a 9070 XT.

[u/rawk0r → u/shhbb]

I had a 5090 for over a year and ended up selling it recently to switch to a 9070XT over constant fear of melting/fire (I have diagnosed anxiety).

[u/DigitalStefan → u/rawk0r]

Same but with a 4090.

Someone in this sub told me earlier today I was dumb.

Maybe I am dumb, but also my GPU isn’t likely to melt, I paid pre-rise MSRP and I made around £200 back when selling my 4090, which means i overall spent around £400 to have the enjoyment of a 4090 for a year and a 9070XT at the end of it.

[u/rawk0r → u/DigitalStefan]

Same. I made about $100 after shipping/insurance.

[u/jar36 → u/DigitalStefan]

I traded in my 3 month old 4070ti Super for a 9070xt. I'm on Linux, I was worried about the connection melting and I got to trade it in for $650 toward the 9070xt. Sure, I lost some money in that deal. The 4070 cost $1250 due to anticipating tariffs. The 9070xt wasn't out yet and it was coming out days after tariffs were to kick in. I figured the 9070xt would be even more expensive so I got the 4070 instead. Just wish I knew the 9070xt wasn't going to cost but about half of that or I'd have just waited 2 weeks.

[u/DigitalStefan → u/jar36]

The Linux compatibility aspect of Radeon GPUs isn’t lost on me. I’m mulling the idea of moving to CachyOS on my gaming PC. I think out of 650 games only 4 aren’t compatible.

I’ve been using CachyOS on a laptop and it impresses me every time I boot it up.

I bought an M4 Pro MacBook at the start of the year and although that is much more efficient and quiet, the general UI performance is faster with CachyOS.

[u/jar36 → u/DigitalStefan]

I started with Garuda which is similar to CachyOS in that it's arch based and good for gaming. After a year or so, I installed Arch with the CachyOS kernel and repos.
So now I basically have a stripped down version of CachyOS with a look inspired a bit by Garuda.
Since I don't play competitive online games anymore, every game I want to play works. I'm losing a few features and fps by using Linux over Windows, but Windows threatened to lock my account bc my pihole was blocking their telemetry.
I can't live like that. I started hating booting up. Being disabled, I am on my PC most of the day and it bothered me every minute I was on it.

[u/SomeoneNotFamous → u/rawk0r]

I'm that close tbh, I check it religiously and got the alerts setup.

I hate Nvidia but I hate myself more to be such a bot and go for the most powerful shit when I can afford it, can't help myself.

[u/Houdini2026 → u/shhbb]

https://giphy.com/gifs/1hAxQTH0HEWS3L0oRF

[u/BuHoGPaD]

Can someone educate me what am I looking at? 

[u/f0xpant5]

Does this effectively mean two 12vhwpr connectors are feeding the card, one from the PSU direct, and one through two 8 pin to that little converter you've made? This is intriguing.

[u/DallasGrave → u/f0xpant5]

Essentially. There is a pickup PCB soldered to the contacts for the original 12VHPWR header and that feeds the auxiliary dual 8 pin board.

[u/f0xpant5 → u/DallasGrave]

Keen to see your data, cool idea to drop the load on the single connector.

[u/Zatchillac → u/DallasGrave]

I've been scrolling comments and I feel like I've read this like 6 times already. Is everyone having a hard time reading?

[u/JulianSyv]

https://giphy.com/gifs/MBVemoHuyw9Ik

[u/Ottoman87]

Forgive my ignorance but haven't you just introduced further areas of potential melting points. What about the PSU Side?

Looks like 2x PCIE 8 pins supply that the 12vhpwr?

[u/DallasGrave → u/Ottoman87]

It is three connectors total and they are all in parallel directly at the PCB. The per conductor draw is dramatically lower as is the temperature. The 12VHPWR is still present. The pins on the board aren't the issue. It functions much like any other board with multiple connectors.

[u/PalamariVarkari → u/DallasGrave]

As long as the connector exists without a per pin load control, you didn't solve anything. The only actual solution would be a device that has the connector solderer on its PCB (no cable) and that PCB doing load balancing between the pins.

[u/DallasGrave → u/PalamariVarkari]

That is exactly what is on there. The aux board exists just to not put physical stress on the PCB.

[u/real_unreal_reality → u/PalamariVarkari]

Why does u/dallasgrave and this guy getting both upvotes. Both can’t exist.

You guys read what he says. “Without it being joined at the pins it doesn’t solve anything”. Like you have to make a direct wire solder no load control or balancing it’s a nothing burger.

🍔 feel free to eat up and make extra work guys.

[u/DallasGrave → u/real_unreal_reality]

You both have a fundamental misunderstanding of how power is distributed to the GPU. The six +12 V pins are already paralleled on the card. Active per pin load balancing would only be relevant because 12VHPWR is operating very close to its per-contact rating at 600 W, so a contact with abnormal resistance can become a thermal problem. That is also why replacing a bad cable or connector can remedy the issue.

The GPU itself does not lack input capacity. The OE contacts have sufficient aggregate capacity. This conversion simply adds additional parallel current paths, reducing the equivalent resistance and dramatically reducing the current carried by each 12VHPWR conductor. On the tested cards, that went from roughly 8 A per conductor to 3.5 A at the same load.

[u/Ottoman87 → u/DallasGrave]

Yeah i completely spaced on the other power cable coming from underneath the card.

We need more details

[u/DallasGrave → u/Ottoman87]

There is a pickup PCB soldered to the contacts for the original 12VHPWR header and that feeds the auxiliary dual 8 pin board. The power draw and temperature across all conductors is substantially lower, about ~3A. The card was running full load for 48 hours at 550W and the wires never crossed 40c even at the joint.

[u/real_unreal_reality → u/Ottoman87]

I agree with this analysis. It doesn’t “solve” shit.

[u/DallasGrave → u/real_unreal_reality]

And you would be wrong. There is a pickup PCB soldered to the contacts for the original 12VHPWR header and that feeds the auxiliary dual 8 pin board. The power draw and temperature across all conductors is substantially lower, about ~3A. The card was running full load for 48 hours at 550W and the wires never crossed 40c even at the joint.

[u/real_unreal_reality → u/DallasGrave]

Hush little op don’t say a word. Dude above me pointed out more points of failure doesn’t fix the issue.

You glued in a fucking connector on top of your 6000 dollar gpu. Congrats.
https://giphy.com/gifs/xT0xezQGU5xCDJuCPe

[u/DallasGrave → u/real_unreal_reality]

I didn't post any of what's happening internally for good reason. I'm a PNY manufacturing partner. Look at my posts. I'm about as far from DIY as you could possibly get.

[u/Ottoman87 → u/DallasGrave]

That's cool, Sorry for this unnecessary reaction you seem to be getting.

[u/EvilDan69]

So apparently you should be running the remastered witcher 3 at max settings.

[u/qu38mm]

https://giphy.com/gifs/n3p6JiIG0TzCU

[u/cartaio95]

I’ve been getting strange ads for power connectors lately… NVIDIA PLEASE PICK ONE OF THE OTHERS AND IGNORE THAT SHITTY CONNECTOR YOU MADE PLS!

[u/Dirtcompactor]

Think I'll stick to my safeguard+ PSU lol 

Looks neat though 

[u/7Sans]

does anyone know like the reason nvidia is forcing this new socket? there must be some kind of upgrade/positive that the new one does better compare to when it was 3x 8pins?

[u/Ottoman87 → u/7Sans]

I don’t know this, but i think its for the server/data centres 1 cable instead of 3

But that doesn’t explain why no Nvidia AIB put any 8pins on their cards even the low end.

I am betting that Nvidia has forced their AIB's to stick with this new connector where AMD has not.

[u/Zatchillac → u/Ottoman87]

But that doesn’t explain why no Nvidia AIB put any 8pins on their cards even the low end.

Am I misunderstanding something here? Some Nvidia cards still use 8-pin connectors. I built a PC for someone last year with a 5060ti 16GB that used a single 8-pin

[u/Ottoman87 → u/Zatchillac]

👀 Oh, You learn something new everyday.

I just looked and you are indeed right.

[u/saltyboi6704]

Makes me wonder if it's worth experimenting with a Micro-Fit BMI header and bypassing the interlock outright...

If done right on a large copper pour I reckon it can heatsink the "receptacle" enough that the contacts can carry more unbalanced current.

[u/No_Interaction_4925]

Can you explain what you’ve actually done here? I just don’t get it

[u/DallasGrave → u/No_Interaction_4925]

There is a separate PCB soldered to the pins where the 12VHPWR header is attached. That PCB has wires that lead to the auxiliary board with dual 8 pins. It distributes the load across 6 more conductors.

[u/hamfinity]

It would have been better if you added a wiring diagram. Your images are not helping people understand since all the connections are covered.

[u/_Synds_]

How would this work on a 5090 Astral, as it needs 4 pcie cables? I'm assuming just adding two more to the converter.

[u/jonstarks]

any chance PNY will cover this under their warranty?

[u/DallasGrave → u/jonstarks]

We're a PNY partner. You'll be able to buy a PNY specific card with a similar modification directly from us with a full warranty.

[u/Jmeboy → u/DallasGrave]

Even though PNY just denied a users warranty recently because they used the native 12V-2x6 issues with the PSU instead of the awful adapter supplied by PNY with the GPU?

[u/DallasGrave → u/Jmeboy]

It would be mailed back to and handled by us.

[u/Maleficent_Bridge_41 → u/DallasGrave]

That's pretty nice - would you offer some mail-in of PNY cards as well? In this case RTX 6000s (Workstation), we are kinda afraid of loosing the investment to a melting issue..

[u/Euphoric_Rabbit_8463]

I want a rtx too (who the hell is down voting me, get your ahh out of here, getting downvoted for wanting a rtx like they be hating on anything, I am stuck witha working laptop for four years now)